Saturday, November 22, 2014

The Insanity of Repeated Spankings

When I was growing up and did something wrong I was disciplined – spanked to be specific.  I can’t tell you how many times I remember my mother saying, “You just wait until your father gets home”.  The typical way this played out was that when dad got home, mom would tell him what terrible thing I did, dad would confront me (he had to get worked up to carry out his part of the job, you know), then he’d shout, “Get upstairs to your bedroom.” I’d turn and hightail it up the steps. There were 13 steps in our house – actually 14, but I had to turn right to step on the 14th.  I learned real quick that I needed to fly up those 13 stairs because dad would smack my butt until I made the right hand turn and flew down the hall and into my bedroom crying in pain.  He always got in 5 whacks no matter how fast I ran. It was whack 4 and 5 that did the damage. The first three just softened me up. When I got to high school I was a sprinter. Maybe dad had something to do with that.

When I reached 5th or 6th grade I don’t remember getting a ‘lickin’.  Rather I’d lose privileges like not getting an allowance, not permitted to go over a friend’s house or some other similar pain they’d impose.  When I became a parent I modeled my parents – yes I made my children’s butt nice and red when they were young. No I am not an Adrian Peterson but I believe in the adage, spare the rod and spoil the child when the situation arose. I didn't have to spank them many times but I had to a few with each.  I now have beautiful adult kids that are model citizens and love their dad – and as an aside so I didn't 'beat' them - if that is what you are thinking. I learned that the key to punishment is not the whacking or loss of a privilege but rather the talking that goes on between parent and child after the emotional storm has passed.  The teaching is not in the beating. Any moron can do that. The teaching is explaining why they were spanked and talking with them about how they can make a better choice next time.  My parents never did the educational part – maybe they were morons – but to beat a child and then do nothing else…. Come on, we’re better than that. We need to teach so bad actions are not repeated.

As a fifty something adult, I’ve been physically punished by Katie only once.  That was about four years ago. I have not been punished since.  In the femdom, Domme/sub, Domme/slave world discipline is a part of many adult spousal relationships.  My personal opinion is….. Why in the world is an adult woman hitting an adult man?  I mean, really, is it really necessary?  I understand in the mind of a small child that they don’t yet understand higher levels of learning and so physical pain works wonders when used on a mind that has an IQ not very well developed.  But as the brain matures, most parents would agree that other forms of punishment work just as well or better than the spanking they use to use.  Now I know that those that read this blog are smart, intelligent, higher level thinking people. You don’t have a 2nd grade brain. You understand things clearly. You may be stubborn but you aren’t dumb.  So, if I have you pegged right, why do you need to be repeatedly spanked? I mean, why does your wife need to treat you in the same way she does your eight year old son or daughter? Why do you get treated more immaturely then your fifteen year old? Can you see where I’m going with this? Where's the consistency? Where's the parallel to how we raise children as they develop intellectually and emotionally?

I don’t know that Katie would ever spank me again even if the same situation arose. (I asked her after writing this and learned that she would and do so even harder next time.) I know that if I was your Domme I could drive home my point by dropping you off a mile or so from home have you remove your shirt, give you a cinder block and tell you to carry it above your shoulders to the back door. Believe me; you’d never repeat the wrong you did again. Your hands would be raw, your back and shoulders sore, your chest probably all scraped up from the block rubbing against you – and I wouldn’t even have to raise a hand.  Waha – mission accomplished.  And if you made the same mistake I’d double the distance next time. Sooner or later you’d get the point real fast.

When I was a child I rarely repeated my mistakes because the pain of the punishment hurt too much. Yes I did things wrong again and again in some areas of my life but as the whacks became harder or if dad opted to follow me into the bedroom to deliver a few more blows, I soon learned the pleasure of the wrong just wasn’t worth the pain of the correction.  What I don’t get with domestic discipline is the physical aspect itself but even more – why so many wives are having to repeat the spanking so many times?  In my simple mind, if it needs to be repeated then this method of discipline obviously needs to be altered to something more effective.  In the medical world they call it evidence based practice, meaning that things are done because they work – or not done because they’ve been shown not to be effective. Insurance companies don’t reimburse if the same treatment is given again and again without improvement demonstrated. If you’ve had a surgery you might be entitled to 10 visits to a therapist but not 20. Insurance companies know the statistics; that a good therapist can return you to full health in those limited visits. They aren’t paying out for the 50 visits they use to do back in the 1980’s.

If your wife spanks you and has to repeat the spanking many times, isn’t the handwriting on the wall? Isn’t it clear to her that this method of punishment isn’t working?  Might she need to change tactics? Maybe all she needs to do is to sit you down like the mature adults you are and have a direct conversation with you explaining what she is upset with and what you need to do to prevent a recurrence rather than drag you by the ear over to the bed, and beat the you know what out of you for the 85th time in the past two years?  It’s obvious that after 85 times something isn’t working here and that spanking isn't proving to be the deterrent she thought it would serve. After all, the goal here is behavioral modification.

OK, I’ve intentionally tried to stir the pot but I’ve done so with a purpose.  I hope that those of you engaged of domestic discipline will chime in and share perspectives. Guys, do you hate to be spanked or is this a game, a form of D/s play in some respects? The proof is in the pudding. If it works it rarely should have to be repeated. If it is repeated often then what’s the deal? 

Mistresses…. How do you feel? After all, you’re the one deciding on what form of discipline he will get. Maybe you like beating his ass and so you repeat the insanity of doing something that doesn’t really produce changed behavior. Maybe you do it to please him. Maybe you do it because you enjoy it. Maybe it’s all just a game. Maybe you’ve not thought of other more effective ways of correcting misbehavior. Love to hear the thoughts of others.

I’m Hers


34 comments:

  1. In most femdom households spanking has become kind of a game. More than anything else it is the husband who wants to have his butt whipped, and he does whatever to achieve this objective. In my life I have known of at least one mistress who has taken 'spanking' to more of an extreme. We are no longer in contact, but this lady's husband lived in absolute fear of her. In my opinion the relationship was abusive. Why he stayed in the marriage I don't know. Often times we wonder why women stay in abusive relationships. My guess is that men sometimes stay for many of the same reasons women stay in them.

    For my part I have never believed in the idea of spanking a man. It is not effective. And, spanking is not ladylike. For my the husband the best punishments have always been either extra work assignments or withdrawal of privileges. I also agree that the talk is the most important part of the punishment. I will ask John if he understands why he has offended me. Then, I ask him to repeat the reasons for the punishment back to me. This type of communication is a very effective tool.

    Along with withdrawal of privileges or whatever the standard punishment maybe I will give John corner time. It doesn't need to be for a long time. Fifteen or twenty minutes usually does it. I set a small timer, and he stays in position until the bell rings. It does make him feel like a child. It is humiliating , and in that regard corner times serves its purpose.

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    1. Thank you Kathy. I always love to hear your perspective on things. I may not always agree but I am always interested. In this matter I do agree. I will withhold further opinions for the time being as I'd love to hear from those that do spank. I'd love to know their reasons, especially their justification for spanking upteen times and why they continue with the same method of discipline. And maybe you are correct in stating that this is merely a game that one calls discipline when in fact, it's not discipline at all.

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  2. Accepting the invitation to stir the pot, let's compare repeated spanking with, say, enforced chastity. If a man is truly "submissive," and his wife has ordered him not to masturbate, then why is there a need for a chastity device? Why doesn't he just submit instantly and flawlessly to her wishes by denying himself as instructed.? Two possible explanations (at least). First, it's all just a game. He likes being dominated and she likes to dominate, so for all the pretty words about surrendering to her superior will and wisdom, it's really just she likes putting him in chastity and he likes being told what to do. Similarly, some DD relationships undoubtedly are more anbout Femdom power dynamics than real discipline.

    Or, perhaps she really doesn't like sex and putting him in chastity just removes that annoyance. I'm not sure quite sure what else would explain the insistence that chasity is being imposed "for his own good" when there is pretty strong evidence of the inverse relationship between orgasms per week and the odds of getting prostate cancer.

    Or, perhaps, he has the best of intentions and really wants to do what she tells him, but like most human beings he has various habits and drives and, therefore, sometime backslides and fails. The chastity device is there to counter those all-too-human tendencies to fail despite our own best intentions.

    There also is the question of perspecitve, as in who are we talking about when we ask why the repeated spankings -- hers or his? And, are we talking about the same act leading to repeated discipline, or different ones. One commenter on my blog recently talked about the frequency of his discipline has not changed over the years, but that is because his wife has reset the bar and adjusted those things that he is expected to work on. So, as one behavior becomes less problematic, they address another. Relatedly it may be that a relationship that began with wanting to improve the man's behavior transormed over time into something that also addresses the wife's sense of grievance and gives her an outlet to express it.

    The bottom line is that asking why something "makes sense" in the context of deep seated needs and desires probably does not itself make a lot of sense. I completely understand the reason that some men want to be disciplined physically by their wives. On the other hand, I have absolutely no idea why some men like being ordered to do chores such as picking up their wives' dirty clothes from the floor when it just reinforces her problem with not putting them in the hamper herself. To each his own.

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  3. From my perspective, in regards to why I want to put him in a device, I don't think he wants sex with me enough. So I want to prevent any masturbation so the desire is there more for me. Am I being naive or oversimplistic about this? I don't know. I've heard even men say that they could give their word about it, but one determined "other woman" and that could all change. I realize my comment has nothing to do with spanking. If I did spank him, it would probably be more for the kink aspect, because he enjoys it, rather than for real punishment. I think, anyway. :) J

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  4. Dan and J, Love the discussion. Thanks for commenting. Dan, I believe your bottom line is that DD is done because it is fun and for whatever reason builds a stronger bond between husband and wife. If that is not the case then it still makes no sense why a wife uses a form of discipline pretty much intended for the very young then for older children. I mean, you don't see many parents slapping the fingers of their 15 year old for trying to sneak twinkies out of the house from the cupboard. That form of discipline is usually used for younger children as a teaching tool. Not sure why it is used on a 52 year old unless it has a 'fun/kink' component.

    J, I understand but don't get a man not wanting to have sex every day and all day :) I am more the energizer bunny type then the sleepy dwarf. Your comment doesn't have to do with spanking but does have everything to do with what Dan said. Thanks!

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    1. IH, no, not really, My bottomline is that people do all sorts of things for all sorts of reasons. Spanking may be most often be imposed on young children. It's also imposed in Singapore, in the form of judicial caning, on adults as punishment for serious offenses. And until a couple of decades ago, it was imposed with strappings in prisons in both the southern US and Canada.

      I definitely don't see the DD variety of spankng as "fun" for the recipient, if it is really being done for disciplinary purposes. Again, I'm not sure that "makes no sense " comes into it anymore than it comes into trying to understand why, in Femdom relationships, a grown man feels the need to kneel at the feet of a woman, wearing a dog collar. Or, "what sense it makes" for one person in a relationship to dictate to another everything that goes on in the relationship to the point that becomes the "slave" of another, I personally think that DD makes "more sense" in that respect, becaust I think most couples that initiate it genuinely believe they are doing it to try to either (a) make the man behave better; and/or (b) empower the woman to take more control and impose boundaries on the man. In those cases, DD is trying to empower someone who may have been disempowered before, while grounding and humbling a party who may really need that to balance out his own dominant tendencies. I see that as making a lot more sense that someone who is already passive in their temperament emphasizing that by being passive/submissive to their life partner.

      But, again, while I may not personally understand what motivates someone who is into something that I am not, to each his own.

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    2. Dan, in the example of Singapore, I could be quite certain that anyone who had been caned there would never want to experience it again. My point being that that kind of discipline is so severe that it truly is a deterrent to future misbehavior on the part of the criminal. I don't believe that is the purpose with discipline in a DD relationship. Well, maybe it is but it sure is a dumbed down version of it.

      I get discipline. I get physical discipline. I get discipline if it's role really is to correct. What I don't get is why somebody needs to be disciplined 50, 75 or 100 times for the same or similar transgressions. I don't get why someone needs to be spanked on a weekly basis. Instead, why not give them a cinderblock and make him carry it for a few hours? It would seem much more effective.

      I also don't get it as a form of discipline to improve a woman self-esteem and feeling of power IF she is doing so with the intent of correcting a behavior that is repeated again and again and again. In that case, the man is simply ignoring her dust causing the repeated spankings. I do get her beating a man for the sake of beating him. That's power, however sadistic in nature it might be. I get that. My friend m, Who writes the blog my life, her way, is an example here. For him, those beatings are a form of play but they are beating still the same. It's not meant to be discipline it's just meant to be kinky fun.

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  5. In some agreement with Dan, let's assume that the purpose of spanking, or caning, is not utilitarian. Let's guess that something more is going on. It seems a little dismissive to call it "fun" though, or even "kink". Is anything in serious FLR "fun" or mere "kink"?

    In caning/spanking there is a very real engagement with the surface of the body. The communication from the dominant is incredibly "direct". Whether orders are being verbally given, remembered, or just becoming ingrained, there is a kind of cerebral detachment involved in that kind of domination. With delivered physical pain the communication is well beneath the threshold of concept. It isn't abstract. It is literal. And as the subs skin catches fire there is a transformation that occurs, however momentary. It is the literal transfer and receipt of power. There is no confusion. No translation. Of course this all has to fit into the other contexts of submission and control in the relationship as it is framed. Sometimes this may be fantasized, or placed in other formal power displays, but the physicality is a very special mode of communication.

    wife_rules

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    1. Wife_rules, thank you for sharing your thoughts. I understand and I agree with everything that you say with the exception of one point and it is the point of my post. It is the word "repeated" that I am focusing on. Maybe I should have used words such as "overly common", "weekly", etc. I'm not disputing the value of a spanking every now and then. I think what you stated as it being a form of very direct communication is very true but I would think that even you would admit that if it is delivered 100 times that the 100th time holds different meaning than the 3rd time.

      In the example Dan provided of discipline being a form of punishment in Singapore, the first time serves as the last time. There is no need for a second or third caning. Nobody wants to be disciplined that severely.

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    2. Wife-Rules, your point is very simiilar to mine (I think). People always see their own needs and desires as making more "sense" than others, even where to someone who is wholly vanilla, both forms of "kink" would be looked on as weird and making "no sense." And, I also agree that referring to DD as a mere "kink" denigrates it, when it is no more or less "kinky" and a typical Femdom or FLR relationship, In fact, it may be less so as it seems to come with fewer trappings of the fetish scene.

      And, to use one of my original examples, I don't see how repeiated spankings for the same offense is any more indicative of DD being a "game" than having to be subjected to a chastity device is indicative of "kink" and "game" in a FLR relationship. If you have really submitted and accept your wife's instructions, then why do you need the chastity device? Is it because your FLR relationship is "just a game" or could it be that the men subjected to it try and fail to comply with orders not to have sex (solo oir joint) without permission, just like the DD spanking recipient may try and fail to correct behavior that subjects him to a spanking.

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    3. Dan, here's my view of chastity - for me only. When Katie first put me into chastity the device had a dual purpose - to prevent me from masturbating and to remind me that I am hers. I've never been 'locked' but rather secured only with a screw that I can remove at any time. Now, chastity serves more as a reminder that I am hers. She doesn't worry about me masturbating anymore - and neither do I. And so for me, continued chastity is a reminder - kind of like the wedding band I wear; kind of like the collar some subs wear. But you are saying that repeated discipline is different. For some I think it might be just a game. Let me use SubHub as an example. I believe there is a component of discipline involved but I believe even he would admit he enjoys it at some level. He stated as such in a previous comment on an my last post. And that is ok. I get that. I just don't think that if his wife really wants to correct something once and for all - as the Singapore authorities do - that this is the best option. But it works at some level and as wife_rules noted, the direct physical contact of a woman, physically touching a man in an uncomfortable way is a powerful connection that can bond two individuals - that is if there is a teaching component following. If not, then it falls into the realm of Adrian Peterson, in which he disciplined his child and it cost him several million dollars because others deemed it excessive.

      All of this doesn't address why use physical punishment on a mature mind when higher levels of approach may really be the better option.

      My desire..... I wish Katie would use physical punishment - or at least experiment with it. She's done it once and although she hit me as hard as she could, it really didn't hurt that much. But I liked it :)

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    4. I think you are ascribing a greater level of rationality to the control mechanism your wife is comfortable with (chastity device) than to the one preferred by some other women (spanking), seeing the repeated application of one as a "reminder" while the other is labeled as "insanity." Why would a chastiy device be necessary to condition a "mature mind." Isn't the higher level approach just to talk about why the imposition of chastity is seen to be necessary or desirable? And, I still dont get why imposing chastity is seen as more rational in an adult relationship than using corporal punishment. Most aduit relationships seek to increase the amount of sex, not decrease it. So, to me, wanting to restrict orgasms seems "insane."

      But, I recognize that my preferences against chasity are just that, preferences. Lacking in any objective value. And, it's a preference that obviously isn't shared by a lot of the DD community, because when I opened up this subject on my blog, I was surprised at how much enthusiasm there was for something that I am not attracted to at all.

      The fact that you liked physical punishent may mean corporal punishment really would not be effective for you. It's hard to know until you get one that reallly does hurt -- a lot. But, I do recognize that for some people, including people who claim to be into DD, spanking just is not a punishment because they DO enjoy it, want it, crave it. For myself, I separate it into two aspects, control and punishment. I very much do crave the surrendering of control to another person,and the redirection of control, that is involved in the spanking process. But, that does not mean that I enjoy the spanking. I most certainly do not.

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    5. Domestic disciple is just that - discipline
      Chastity is just that - a restriction of a man to touch his penis.
      The former espouses correction, the latter restriction. Chastity is not intended to punish; discipline in all of its forms is. All I am saying is that if you have to discipline anyone, again and again and again and again, regardless of the method - that method isn't working. If the responsible party doesn't mind repeating the act then so be it but if they really have a desire to not have to confront and assert their authority then another means of teaching seems only appropriate.

      Katie never put me in chastity as a punishment. In fact I asked for it. I don't know if wives discipline their husbands because they do wrongs she wishes them not to continue. If they do I hope for the woman's sake that she needn't resort to disciplining often. It's disrespectful on the man's part if she must because they are not obeying previous orders.

      I am not equating chastity and discipline as being in the same category. One is to restrict something from taking place (but is not a punishment) while the other is a reaction to something that has already taken place.

      I understand that this post is an afront to the purpose of your blog. My intention is not to say spanking is wrong but I question those that need it again and again and again - that is, unless it is done with the purpose of bonding, fun, or kink.

      I think we will agree to disagree here and I thank you for doing just that. You've made me think and for that I thank you!

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    6. That your adult children turned out well has nothing to do with your hitting them. Spanking children only shows them that you can take control of them because you are bigger and stronger and they are smaller and defenseless. It only teaches them to fear you. Did you want that? They can learn what you want to teach them with your words, not your hand. Because they are in the second grade doesn't mean they can't understand or reason. Teach them to understand ideas and to reason well. That's a parent's job.

      If you think it's ok to hit children, is it also to hit dogs, cats, brothers, sisters, me? Can I hit you? I don't think so. Unless you're in a kinky relationship and it's safe, sane and consensual, no hitting. If you think it's ok to hit children would you put it on You Tube?

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  6. Thankfully Diane has at last said what needed to be said straight off. Hitting children is just plain wrong and never justified and in civilised countries is a crime - just as men hitting women (and vice versa) is a crime.

    Spanking etc between freely consenting adults can be fun. And yes there are better ways of getting children and adults to change behaviour.

    Tony

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  7. Holy smoke IH, did you ever stir the pot!! Nice job ... again! *smile

    Not surprisingly I have some comments on this wonderful topic. In case I forget to eventually get to my point, let e just say that in this wonderful world of female-led existence, the diversity of opinions and lifestyles is a wonderful thing to behold. We all have our individual preferences, likes/dislikes, kinks, emotional safe-horbors, along with a million other factors that go in to the absolute, deep-rooted love that each of has for our respective mates, be they Dom/Domme or sub.

    One of the things about you that I like IH is your abundance of logic. I love logic and reasonableness. In fact I absolutely abhore the lack of reasonableness that often appears in our respective vision of how the world works. But, at the end of the day, the variety and different spices (of life) that we each uniquely aspire to/subscribe to is just wonderful because it actually seems to defy logic to others, even ourselves when we are drawn to certain behaviors, smells, tastes, desires, existence .... etc.

    Whereas I can be in total respect and admiration of the opinions of people whose opinion I admire (looking in your direction IH and Kathy), mine can be completely different for a variety of unknown reasons and still be just as valid. I comes down to how we intend to label things, usually in some sort of attempt to persuade others to agree, and if we can it with logic and an abundance of reasonableness, it might make sense even though we may not agree.

    When it comes to discipline spankings, I love and hate them. I love the idea of having to present myself in a decidedly submissive fashion in order to receive a physical puishment for something I may have wrong, or badly, or frankly, even if she just wants me to. I love the notion she wishes to use such a method to train me to be the kind of man/husband that she wants me to be. I love knowing that, on some level, a kink of mine will be used in such a way that will bring to edge of not liking what is about to happening to me. The opposing emotions is just so delicious. Right after being immersed in the part that I don't like (having my ass reddened by my determined Mistress), I am usually allowed to experience the next part of the process that I so much love. The aftercare. There is hardly any better feeling that I can imagine then when I am kneeling before her, naked and with my ass on fire, hugging her around the waist while she gently strokes my head and holds me back. Those few minutes are as tender a time for us together as any other. Being together in that deep, emotionally safe place is very important for us. continued ..................

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    1. ......... continued

      Does the spanking fix my behavior completely and forever? No, of course it doesn't. Does it change my behavior in a way that each of us desires? Yes it does. Is it at all logical? Probably not. Mistress K. will only use my chastity cage for punishment. Dan's point made in a previous comment is spot-on when trying to be logical about a point of view. On one hand, spankings make absolutely now logical, reasonable sense because it is logical to assume that grown-ups should not be expected to have their behavior changed using such a method. Yet, on the other hand, as Dan mentioned, the use of a chastity doesn't make logical sense either. I have absolutely no trouble not touching myself in ay way sexually because it is the will of my Mistress that I do not. Totally logical, right? At the end of the day, as an adult, if I make a promise to my Mistress that I will not do a thing, shouldn't I logically be expected to adhere to that promise? Of course I should. Works for me and although I can logically be trusted not to violate the trust of my beloved Mistress in such a way, other-also reasonable and logical people may perceive that they need that piece of steel or plastic to completely isolate and lock-down their sex organ in order to adhere to a rule set for them. To me, it doesn't seem at all logical, but i do understand it.

      Great post my friend. Of all the bloggers I follow and admire, you are chief among them because I believe that we have a very similar logical and reasonable approach to things. Even though we don't always agree, that very logic and reason are among the things that are the source of my admiration for you. Oh, and Kathy too.

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  8. not sure why but spankings are a big turn on for many men. they pay big bucks at pro dommes to have it done.

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  9. Hi I'm Hers,

    I have read everyone's comments with interest. Let me get the basic line stated, abusing children, animals, none consenting adults etc is just wrong.

    In my case of course things are different, I have freely agreed to submit to my Wife/Mistress. When we first met (at a Munch) there could be no doubt how the dynamics of our relationship would evolve.

    Part of my submission is to agree to control and obedience, with that comes chores, control and discipline.

    I would like to explain the difference in my view between play and punishment. I have mentioned this in previous blogs I've written. Play is just that, our sort of play is not for everyone and I can fully accept that. Play for me can be sensual, pushing me into subspace, it can be sexual, it can be hard and painful where the care and love afterwoods enable me to complete the circle. The big difference between play and punishment is that I can say Please a Mistress I'm not up for it today. Funnily enough that happened yesterday at a Femdom Play Event. Well we had played heavily on Friday for 3 hours, I thought my rear had recovered, I quickly realised I was wrong......OUCH lol. Mistress picked up on this and move on to some other type of play.

    Punishment is something totally different, it normally starts with a verbal warning, if I ignore this, and yes this prat does at times I get corner time. If I'm having a really stupid moment it can progress to full punishment. I can assure anyone 6 full blooded strokes with the Caine from Mistress is not to be taken lightly. You would not quickly forget them. In my case it works. Of course Mistress could make me walk with a Cinder block as I'm Hers stated, I assume a cinder block is a breeze block? This would work also. Most effective is for Mistress to take away Her control, not allow me to serve. Make me sit and watch Her do the chores I would normally do.

    So why does Mistress use physical punishment? Simply She takes the view that if She feels I should be punished, why shouldn't She at least enjoy the punishment. She likes to use a Caine so to Her mind why not as long as it works.
    me carrying at block would work for me, but maybe not for a Her.
    I'm Hers, you say your wonderful Goddess has stated that She would hit you again. Could I toss this thought into the air, both sides of the party have to feel the punishment has been effective. Please ask Her how She felt after hitting you, satisfied? Happy to move on and leave the offense behind? I could be totally wrong and I hope I'm not stepping out of line.

    Finally I have never looked to get punished, if I did a Mistress would sus it out and would just ignore me. A commen remark I've heard many times from Mistresses is that most subs just look to get punished, so therefore they are of little use to a Lady.

    And finally finally punishment that is open is far more honest than the mental abuse and punishment that some men (mostly men) dish out to the one they claim to love!
    m






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    1. m,
      Thank you for taking the time to explain your position. You know, I get exactly how Mistress S handles your situation. You have described a clear delineation between "play spanking" and "punishment spanking". As you described both can be painful but the latter is substantially more painful and one that you care not to endure often. I get that. I also like that she sits you down, talks to you, gives you corner times..... in other words, she doesn't use the harsh stuff unless your really are acting like a prat (another one of those English terms that I like :).

      As for your comment about Katie - she didn't enjoy hitting me. It's not who she is. She did it because I was a gigantic prat and crossed the line irresponsibly and in a way that directly disrespected her and our relationship. She said she'd do it harder next time mostly because she learned after she used a whip on me that it didn't hurt that bad - even though it left my body all red.

      Sub Hub,
      Thank you my friend for taking the time to explain your position. Your position is different from m's. There is a bit of "I like this" even in the punishment that your wife gives you. I understand that and am glad you feel open and honest enough to state that. To me, that means your spankings fall into a type of punishment but also one that you enjoy nevertheless. I know when I was whipped that I enjoyed it. Specifically I remember telling Katie, "harder" or "that wasn't so bad". There was a part of me that dreaded the punishment but another part of me that wondered how much I could take. Like m, he takes quite the abuse during his play time but there is a level of trust and respect with his Mistress that she refrains from going too far during their play times that get physical in nature. For you, I would dare say that the punishment yet to be delivered may indeed be like what m endures during his playtime.

      What I get with your comments is that the repetetiveness of SubHubs spankings are there because they really have a kink/play (call it what you will) component whereas the lack of frequency in real punishments from m are because they really really do hurt - kind of like the Singapore whippings that Dan described.

      My Hearts Desire and Diane,
      Thank you for writing. I really didn't appreciate the comment and insinuations made by the two of you mostly because you made such broad sweeping accusations. As m noted right off, ABUSE is wrong regardless of where it is delivered. I have never abused my children and for you to think I did so to have committed a crime or to associate what I've done with abusing animals is ludicrous. With that said, I hope you will continue to contribute to the blog. I harbor no hard feelings and MHD, have welcomed your input many times in the past. I hope you both will continue to read and contribute.

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  10. Corporal discipline is more than "punishment" for a specific offense. By submitting to corporal discipline the male is acknowledging the power the Female Owner has over him. It can be purely symbolic in some relationships but in others taking actual pain for one's Wife adds to the ritual. Why did the Spartan warriors submit to whippings? Why did the Sioux do the Ghost Dance where the nipples were tortured? In the movie "A Man Called Horse" when the protagonist asks to join the Sioux he is asked "where are your marks!" indicating he does not have Ghost Dance scars and ultimately he undergoes it. Being able to take a hard beating from one's Wife brings satisfaction in the achievement. But it is no different really from kneeling before Her or kissing Her butt on command. It is an acknowledgement of Her superiority. (S's slave)

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    1. Please re-read my comment carefully. There are no accusations in it. There are no broad, sweeping generalizations. Instead I asked questions. Questions that I hoped would cause you to think about hitting children. Each statement I made can be backed up in the psychiatric and psychological literature.

      I expected a defensive reaction. You didn't defend hitting your children. Instead, you accused me of making accusations, sweeping generalizations, and insinuations. There's an old saw about this kind of reaction: shooting the messenger.

      If you have grandchildren, do you hit them? What is the difference between them and your children? Both are or were small and defenseless.

      The other commenter called it abuse. I don't disagree. I call it psychologically damaging because it is. Children do not forget that the people they depend upon for their survival, which they must do because human offspring need the greatest amount of time being dependent upon their primary caretakers of all mammals, hurt them. Do children cry when they are hit? Yes. It hurts body and mind. It's humiliating and embarrassing.

      Love is a far better teacher than corporal punishment. Love and reason are so much more powerful.

      I don't fault you for spanking your children. It's my earnest hope that this practice is ending, in this country and all places everywhere.


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    2. Most respectfully Ms. Jones, why did you respond to my comment and talk about hitting children. Mistress S and I have no children and nothing in my post was about hitting children. Did you mean to hit reply to another comment and were indented under mine by mistake or is this a computer error? (S's slave)

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    3. S's slave, Ms Jones comment was directed to me. She did not mean to offend you.

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    4. Diane, I am giving your thoughts consideration. I will write another post on this topic at some point when I have time to do so. Like anything in life, I'm sure there are statistics that back up anything you want - just listen to to the pre-election commercials. I am not negating your comment but saying that statistics can be made to explain almost anything.
      Enjoy your Thanksgiving.

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    5. S's slave, so are you telling me you want to be spanked just so you can say "I can take that'? I'd rather make out with Katie and say "I endured that" than be turned into a squabbling blunder of tears and anguish after being beaten to a pulp.

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    6. S never beats me "to a pulp". She has powerful shoulders and strong hands and has given me a hiding from time to time. However, She is careful not to do permanent damage to Her property. Obviously this is not your thing whch is fine. (S's slave)

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  11. Great discussion. I added a comment but it seems it didn't make the site.

    I would only suggest that repeated spankings/canings are no more insane than repeated Confessions in Catholicism (no matter your religious beliefs), it is the ritualistic submission to power and a process of transformation. The repeated nature of it shows that it is ritualistic, that its purpose is to re-engrain and deepen the power-exchange, and exchange that is never complete or over. It's the same reason Christmas does not happen only once, or a wife's feet are not kissed only once. It is a rite, not a utility.

    wife_rules

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    1. wife_rules, you know, that analogy makes sense to me - repeated confessions analogous to repeated spankings. I see value in routines. Thank you for sharing that!

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    2. I have not read all comments word for word.I get spankings from my wife as needed.It was my idea to start with .They are not for play or punishment so to speak.There is some science to it.I had read where spankings release stress,as I tend to get stressed out from work and can not get relief .I get grumpy and hard to get along with,and that is not who or what I want to be.I read that the body releases adorphins when we are spanked,and that helps with stress relief and make us feel better.I don't like the pain the spanking causes,but have found that with in 10 minutes after it is over I begin to feel much better and the stress is gone.Sometimes I need spankings a few days apart to keep me on track,other time I can go a few weeks before needing the relief from the stress that builds up in me.At first my wife did not like giving them,but did like the out come. As for me I think it takes a lot of love for my wife to do this for me.It helps me to be the man I want to be ,and not a victim of the stress That builds up inside me from the job I have or life in general.Spanking is like medication for me,and has to be repeated. People don't take blood pressure medicine one time and are good for life,it has to be taken every day.Do a google search for stress relief spankings ,or spanking science,or similar search.You should find a lot of info about why spankings work.A side note that I have noticed.If my wife has had a stressful day or week at work,and I am do for a spanking,she seems to be in a much better mood after it is finished as well.She does not admit this,but I have noticed it.

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    3. To S's slave,

      My post wasn't in response to yours. It just appeared below yours. As I'm Hers said, my comment was directed to him. I didn't mean any offense.

      To I'm Hers, the evidence that backs up my statements has little or nothing to do with statistics. It's dealing with the fallout in later years. I appreciate the uses and abuses of statistics. The abuses of statistics was one of the first things we were shown as undergrads in statistics.

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  12. Hope Katie and you have a wonderful Thanksgiving. R R

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  13. Hi guys,

    A thing it's possible that the seasonal disorder affect has kicked in, let's be friends.
    m

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